We Kid You Not Childfree Forums

Originally posted by Truckerswife:

PARENT - Job Description


POSITION :
Mom, Mommy, Mama, Ma
Dad, Daddy, Dada, Pa, Pop

JOB DESCRIPTION :

Long term, team players needed, for challenging
permanent work in an,
often chaotic environment.
Candidates must possess excellent communication
and organizational skills and be willing to work
variable hours, which will include evenings and weekends
and frequent 24 hour shifts on call.
Some overnight travel required, including trips to
primitive camping sites on rainy weekends and endless sports tournaments in far away cities!
Travel expenses not reimbursed.
Extensive courier duties also required.

RESPONSIBILITIES :

The rest of your life.
Must be willing to be hated, at least temporarily,
until someone needs $5.
Must be willing to bite tongue repeatedly.
Also, must possess the physical stamina of a
pack mule
and be able to go from zero to 60 mph in three seconds flat
in case, this time, the screams from
the backyard are not someone just crying wolf.
Must be willing to face stimulating technical challenges,
such as small gadget repair, mysteriously sluggish toilets
and stuck zippers.
Must screen phone calls, maintain calendars and
coordinate production of multiple homework projects.
Must have ability to plan and organize social gatherings
for clients of all ages and mental outlooks.
Must be willing to be indispensable one minute,
an embarrassment the next.
Must handle assembly and product safety testing of a
half million cheap, plastic toys, and battery operated devices.
Must always hope for the best but be prepared for the worst.
Must assume final, complete accountability for
the quality of the end product.
Responsibilities also include floor maintenance and
janitorial work throughout the facility.

POSSIBILITY FOR ADVANCEMENT & PROMOTION :

None.
Your job is to remain in the same position for years, without complaining, constantly retraining and updating your skills,
so that those in your charge can ultimately surpass you

PREVIOUS EXPERIENCE :

None required unfortunately.
On-the-job training offered on a continually exhausting basis.

WAGES AND COMPENSATION :

Get this! You pay them!
Offering frequent raises and bonuses.
A balloon payment is due when they turn 18 because
of the assumption that college will help them
become financially independent.
When you die, you give them whatever is left.
The oddest thing about this reverse-salary scheme is that
you actually enjoy it and wish you could only do more.

BENEFITS :

While no health or dental insurance, no pension,
no tuition reimbursement, no paid holidays and
no stock options are offered;
this job supplies limitless opportunities for personal growth, unconditional love,
and free hugs and kisses for life if you play your cards right.


Forward this on to all the PARENTS you know, in appreciation for everything they do on a daily basis,
letting them know they are appreciated
for the fabulous job they do...
or forward with love
to anyone thinking of applying for the job.
** AND A FOOTNOTE "THERE IS NO RETIREMENT -- EVER!!!
[/quote]

Okay, so I have the difficult task of getting my husband on the same page as me on the children thing. I started this with him a few months ago and it created some arguing. But I think we got through it with some understanding... He understands that I DO NOT WANT KIDS. Right now... See, I'm thinking I need to get rid of that "right now" part, 'cause it may not ever happen. The above just drives that point home.

So, at this point I need your opinions, please. I want to send this to my husband, but I don't want to start an argument. Is there a good way to head into it? He knows I'm all uppity on the subject and he doesn't deal with it well. He's kinda immature, so he'll say something that'll just get my hackles all up and...ugh...

Truckerswife Wrote:I got this in an E-Mail.
I thought this was too good not to share.
This might help anyone who is still on the fence about the subject.
This might help put it in terms that one can relate to in
The real work a day world, LOL


PARENT - Job Description


POSITION :
Mom, Mommy, Mama, Ma
Dad, Daddy, Dada, Pa, Pop

JOB DESCRIPTION :

Long term, team players needed, for challenging
permanent work in an,
often chaotic environment.
Candidates must possess excellent communication
and organizational skills and be willing to work
variable hours, which will include evenings and weekends
and frequent 24 hour shifts on call.
Some overnight travel required, including trips to
primitive camping sites on rainy weekends and endless sports tournaments in far away cities!
Travel expenses not reimbursed.
Extensive courier duties also required.

RESPONSIBILITIES :

The rest of your life.
Must be willing to be hated, at least temporarily,
until someone needs $5.
Must be willing to bite tongue repeatedly.
Also, must possess the physical stamina of a
pack mule
and be able to go from zero to 60 mph in three seconds flat
in case, this time, the screams from
the backyard are not someone just crying wolf.
Must be willing to face stimulating technical challenges,
such as small gadget repair, mysteriously sluggish toilets
and stuck zippers.
Must screen phone calls, maintain calendars and
coordinate production of multiple homework projects.
Must have ability to plan and organize social gatherings
for clients of all ages and mental outlooks.
Must be willing to be indispensable one minute,
an embarrassment the next.
Must handle assembly and product safety testing of a
half million cheap, plastic toys, and battery operated devices.
Must always hope for the best but be prepared for the worst.
Must assume final, complete accountability for
the quality of the end product.
Responsibilities also include floor maintenance and
janitorial work throughout the facility.

POSSIBILITY FOR ADVANCEMENT & PROMOTION :

None.
Your job is to remain in the same position for years, without complaining, constantly retraining and updating your skills,
so that those in your charge can ultimately surpass you

PREVIOUS EXPERIENCE :

None required unfortunately.
On-the-job training offered on a continually exhausting basis.

WAGES AND COMPENSATION :

Get this! You pay them!
Offering frequent raises and bonuses.
A balloon payment is due when they turn 18 because
of the assumption that college will help them
become financially independent.
When you die, you give them whatever is left.
The oddest thing about this reverse-salary scheme is that
you actually enjoy it and wish you could only do more.

BENEFITS :

While no health or dental insurance, no pension,
no tuition reimbursement, no paid holidays and
no stock options are offered;
this job supplies limitless opportunities for personal growth, unconditional love,
and free hugs and kisses for life if you play your cards right.


Forward this on to all the PARENTS you know, in appreciation for everything they do on a daily basis,
letting them know they are appreciated
for the fabulous job they do...
or forward with love
to anyone thinking of applying for the job.
** AND A FOOTNOTE "THERE IS NO RETIREMENT -- EVER!!!

Okay, so I have the difficult task of getting my husband on the same page as me on the children thing. I started this with him a few months ago and it created some arguing. But I think we got through it with some understanding... He understands that I DO NOT WANT KIDS. Right now... See, I'm thinking I need to get rid of that "right now" part, 'cause it may not ever happen. The above just drives that point home.

So, at this point I need your opinions, please. I want to send this to my husband, but I don't want to start an argument. Is there a good way to head into it? He knows I'm all uppity on the subject and he doesn't deal with it well. He's kinda immature, so he'll say something that'll just get my hackles all up and...ugh...

Anway... What's a good way to try to head into it again. I wanna leave it alone for a while, but I gotta get some quips in here and there so he knows this is not a fleeting feeling.


Thanks, guys.

Julie, Dear Abby always suggests "borrowing" neices/nephews or a friend's kids for a week. That way your DH will get to see more about what taking care of children is like besides just the "Kodak moments". Are there any small children you could borrow?

I'd also suggest pointing out how great life is (without kids). Visit restaurants where brats scream through the meal, and make hideous faces at them, or roll your eyes. In other words, subtly point out that life without kids is great, while life with them sucks.

yeah, i have got to agree with PrairieGirl on this one. Go places that are fun, that normally has a lot of families. Point out how miserable the parents are trying to make little jimmy or little sally the happiest of happy kids. Then point out the couples without kids who are just living life, having a great time, etc. Hopefully after a few "visits" like this, it will really open his eyes to the fact that children are not all they are cracked up to be.

good luck!!!!

-Joe

Get him to read truedadconfessions.com!
Egad I read that once. If only they'd known, I bet we'd have TONS more CF men!

Dana Wrote:Get him to read truedadconfessions.com!
Egad I read that once. If only they'd known, I bet we'd have TONS more CF men!

Oooh! Dana's totally right, that's a really good website. I haven't looked over on there in about a year, so I popped over just now and found this gem:

Quote:09.05.08 4:29p
I have 1 Boy and 2 Girls I hate every last minute with them. I love my wife I want to be with her. I hate dividing her attention with THEM. I wish we never had them. whew I said it!!!

And that's just a drop in the bucket. Certainly there are some dads over there who confess to loving their families, but they are really few and far between compared to the dads like the one I quoted. It looks like from their perspective, kids ruin everything.

Oh, and here's another goodie:

Quote:09.01.08 8:25p
I love not having children. All my daddy friends are miserable. I feel for them.

I like the idea of compare and contrast, like with going places. And borrowing someone else's kids for the weekend. But, before you do, make sure that HE is the only one that takes care of them and you make sure to 'have something important to do' that will take over most if not all of the entire weekend. If he is the one that wants kids do badly, then he is gonna have to do all he work. If nothing else works, then at least you can't say that you did not try. He's just gonna have to get his kids elsewhere.

Thanks for the suggestions... Wow, that site is scary. Ooooh, I like this one..."Child support is a giant rip off and I hated paying alimony, but it is all worth it to come to a nice, beautiful, quiet home without them all!" Hey, I can show him that one and pervertedjustice.com...

Haha, yep...he's just gonna have to get his kids elsewhere...if it's THAT damn important to him.

The thing is, I have this MASSIVE guilt complex. Like, part of me feels bad that I don't wanna breed with him. I had an awful dream last night that involved him going off with some other woman because she had a toddler. I remember seeing the three of them walk off into the sunset before I woke up.

I know, reality isn't like that. I guess I have to keep working on making my own reality. I have to work on not feeling bad about this decision. In the long run...I just want to be left alone to have a simple life. What's wrong with that?

nothing is wrong with that Julie. In the end, it might come down to him having to make the decision of whether to stay with the woman he loves, or leave to find someone to breed with. Hopefully in the end he realizes having kids isnt everything, and that he would rather have a wonderful woman in his life that loves him deeply that will devote her time and attention to him and not split it between him and a bunch of whining crying brats.

good luck!!!

-Joe

Julie -- I'm sorry to say that some stories DO end that way. Ultimately, as Arkved points out, he's going to have to choose between you and dreams of a family. For some people, that pull toward children is VERY strong. I think many of us can tell stories of relationships we had to let go of, because the other wanted kids more than they wanted us.

You shouldn't feel guilty.

DH and I went through a period after I decided I didn't want kids at all but he "definitely" did. I say period like it was a short period of time but it was really around 2 years!

When we started dating and got married we both figured we'd want kids "eventually" and for a while I even really wanted one, but when I stepped back and looked at my situation I immediately, and with NO regrets, decided I would never physically have one so we'd adopt. He took very little convincing to get on board with that (I am a carrier for a genetic condition that could significantly effect my offspring, I also have "female problems" and would have difficulty conceiving...)
Shortly thereafter I realized I didn't want kids at all. I had spent some time babysitting and hanging around some friends with kids and the kids are great- in small doses, I certainly don't hate children I just realized I do NOT have the patience or energy to take care of even one kid 24/7/indefinitely and I would be utterly miserable.

DH and I were at an impasse for about 2 years and it is very, very difficult to bring up the topic without it turning into a fight. It's very easy to get defensive and assume the worst and not have a coherent discussion. The best way I got him to think about it was by us both agreeing we'd talk about it at a certain time (so neither of us felt cornered) and then asking him why he wanted a kid. I told him he should volunteer as a big brother or at a daycare or something for a long time before he's certain. Initially he said that didn't matter because I'd be the one taking care of the kid (so I reminded him I don't want to be stuck with a kid all day) and asked him what would happen if I died? What if I was incapacitated and he had to care for a baby, toddler, or a teenager and me?

He started to think about the actual work involved in being a parent and jumped off the fence on my side and hasn't looked back. We'd both like to be parents in theory, but we're very, very fortunate we realized we really don't have the best personalities or tempers to raise a child before we had one. I've been sterile now for 2 years and we're happier (at least in regards to the parent decision).

Oh, and I'd you're sure I recommend taking control of the birth control if you don't already. Baby rabies can affect men just like women...

I know, Prairie Girl. I'm hoping that doesn't turn out to be the case...but if it does, I'm really not afraid to split up. I've thought about it a lot. NO ONE is going to force me to do something I don't wanna do...NO ONE.

And Kirby, thank you for sharing. Your situation sounds a lot like mine. We're at that impasse right now...just started a few months ago when I REALLY came to the conclusion that kids were not for me. We got married thinking we'd have 'em. Planned when we'd start "trying"...which included me getting off my current anxiety/depression meds to get on something I could be preggo on. THEN I stepped back and studied the situation. We, too, are not the most patient (hubby seriously has the patience of a fruit fly, it's one of the more annoying things about him, he doesn't have patience for some of the stuff I do, how on EARTH could he deal with a kid?!) nor do with have child friendly lifestyle. I don't have female problems, but I DO have genetic conditions that I don't wanna pass on. Both my mother AND oldest brother have type I, insulin dependent diabetes. I will most likely pass that on to my offspring. No, thank you. I'd rather not deal with that after watching my mother suffer so much. I've got the birth control under CONTROL. I never, EVER forget to take it and I can't understand those "ooopses" at all.

I'm so glad you were able to work it out with hubby. Thank you for the suggestion... Right now I'm compiling info. I have to walk on eggshells so as not to start the inevitable argument. But yes, we're going to have to have a constructive convo about this. I've asked him why a few times so far and his answers have been rediculous... "I want someone to give my stuff to..." or "He/She will be so good looking." or the infamous "Who is going to take care of us when we're old?!" No honey, not good enough. How 'bout we take care of ourselves? Huh? How's that concept?

Yea, I'm sure once he realizes that being a parent never ends, he'll understand. And if he doesn't, it'll suck ass, but oh well. Life goes on. Like I've said on other boards, I'd much rather be divorced than a single mother!

Why did I know you would be posting here.
Something inside me KNEW Juliepoo. Especially after reading your intro post in Coffee Shope about how you and your hubby were NOT on the same page when it comes to wanting kids.
So I had a gut feeling you would come here.
I am so glad you did.
I am hoping that you take everything everyone said here under advicement and then proceede to plan B

Quote:Yea, I'm sure once he realizes that being a parent never ends, he'll understand. And if he doesn't, it'll suck ass, but oh well. Life goes on. Like I've said on other boards, I'd much rather be divorced than a single mother!

You said this, Now I hope you mean it. Cause you may have to prove it to yourself someday.
But BEFORE that has to happen.
I would give counceling a try
And what you can do is copy and paste the Post that started this thread about
"PARENT - Job Description" and take it with you to the counselor of your choice. And that way you will have your check list of all of what you agree with.
IF, after that your hubby still wants a child and AFTER he has spent time with a niece or nephew or neighbor kid for a month or so. And he says he still wants one of his own! And if you still want to live the CF way then Divorce is inevitable.

May I ask you? Did You talk about this child rearing thing BEFORE you got married? Or did you too fall into the age old trap of "I can someday change my man"?
I hope not for your sake.
But if you did, you have my sympathies.

People do not change unless they really want to. YOU cannot change a person at all. They have to want to change for themselves.
I wish you all the luck in the world.
And If you feel the need to talk to him prior to talking to a profesional.
I suggest you butter him up really good, before you lay the
CF Bomb on him. juliepoo you will need it.

I figure NO man is worth having a baby for! I know with my DH, I'd end up with all the work. Heck, I have all the work with the dogs, and it was HE that wanted the dogs. I said no. He begged and pleaded. It was that way with BOTH our dogs. He's just lucky I fell in love with them, LOL.

I read that dad site before, like once, and wow, I know parenthood is not all people make it out to be, but for that many people to hate it that much, dang. If only more men (even women) could know before and that they could have a choice, I know more people would just say no to kids!

Julie, does he seem to be caught up with "Kodak Moments" or does he really seem to want to do the work involved? Or does he even know?

Another option is to talk to a counselor. I would be very wary of asking them questions when you are trying to find the right one as you don't want one to pick sides (that seems so common when you are trying to discuss the baby question). We had basically decided we were going to go to some sort of counseling so we could both talk about the situation rationally, but ended up not needing it.

DH really thought I'd change my mind eventually, especially since I actually wanted a kid for a while, but time has just reinforced our choice.

For a while, even after he said he was sure he didn't want kids, I was worried that he would throw it back at me later. Something along the lines of "But we'd be happier if we'd had a baby!" or something. If there is any shot of him blaming you for the regret he feels over not being a parent- the situation will not work. Somehow that hasn't been much of an issue for a long time.

You can't take a kid back and it's one decision that is black or white with no gray area. You have one or you don't. If you aren't sure- don't have one. Your DH sounds like he has been brain washed into thinking that he needs one and hasn't realized the true impact another life will have on his FOREVER.

I know my DH was initially upset because he thought it meant I didn't love him and was rejecting HIM. It took a long time for me to convince him that a baby is not him and I'm not rejecting him, I'm rejecting motherhood. We knew when the situation arose that if we weren't going to come to an agreement we'd get divorced and chalk it up to getting married too young and before we really knew what we wanted. Like you said - it's better to be divorced than a single parent- and that goes for moms or dads!

Hehe! Yup, Truckerswife...HERE I am! Pleading my case...

Dana, I think he is kinda caught up in the old web of society's expectations, along with the "Kodak moment" syndrom. TV doesn't help, with all those damn cute kiddos running by all the time. One time I got, "Are you SURE you don't want one of those?", in that whiney kinda tone. That got the patented "icy stare". All I said was, "Dude, that's lame..." And speaking of tv...GAWD...all those type cast women selling the cleaning goods and the kiddie crap. MOMS the word on tv! Ugh...

Yes Kirby, it's the rejection part I'm worried about, too. I don't want him to get all insulted. I had a great talk with my mom last night though. She's very supportive. It was like a practice run in which I explained my stance on the issue. She totally understood and was even impressed with how much I know myself and what I want. So all I have to do is say the same things to hubby in a tactful manner. In a respectful manner. At this point, I really think he believes I'll change my mind. That's where time comes in. We need some time. When the subject comes up again, I stand my ground and try to remember all the points I've made to other people.

These boards are helping a whole lot. It's always nice to have others on your side to help you.

I would also caution against the attitude of "Getting him on your side" I know that's what you want and that would result in a win-win for you, but if he's really not going to be happy until he's a parent he could just as easily post "getting her on my side" about the baby issue, too. Does that make sense? It's entirely possible that he really will love being a parent, in which case the relationship must end for you both to be happy.

I know that not bringing up the issue for a while helped too. When it was clear where we both stood there was a stalemate and anytime the topic was breached it resulted in a fight (hence the recommendation to see a counselor if your situation persists) so I just forced myself to not bring it up, there were no snide remarks about annoying kids, bad parents, stupid names or what we'd be doing in 5 or 10 years. We both knew that we had different ideas of where we'd be and it would just create tension and another fight.
Eventually he decided he really didn't want them, but when you bombard someone with information they tend to shut down. So while telling him to babysit, sending him links like truedadconfessions.com and stories that you think may help you - seem to make you feel better for getting the information out it might put him on the defensive- and nothing will get done.

If he is in no hurry to have a baby and hasn't really thought about the impact a child will have on his life and you're in no hurry to get on with either your relationship or a new life there is only so much pushing the issue that can be done.

I hope this makes sense.

.02

Yes, that makes total sense, Kirby. Yup...I bombarded hubby with tons of info and all it did was frustrate him at first. I don't wanna throw a buncha stuff at him at once. I'm going to bide my time and resources.

We're not in a hurry right now...but in a year or so I imagine it'll become a big issue again. I'm doing the same thing, forcing myself to shut up when there are annoying kids and bad parents around. I'm also trying to notice the cute in babies... Having a lot of trouble with that one lately... And you're right, I shouldn't take sides. It's such a touchy thing to be going through and I have to be careful.

So, I guess we'll see what happens huh? For now we'll just continue to enjoy life.

Juliepoo15 Wrote:I'm also trying to notice the cute in babies... Having a lot of trouble with that one lately...

That's because there really isnt anything cute about babies. I mean seriously, what is cute about a helpless, crying, blob that does nothing but eat, sleep, crap and pee on itself, vomit all over the place, cant communicate, etc etc etc.

That's the way i see it anyways,

Joe

HAHAHAH, a new quote off of truedadconfessions

Quote:
Dear Childfree people:

You are not missing anything by not having kids, dont let anyone tell you otherwise.

Enjoy your tidy houses, your vast amounts of disposable incomes, your free time, your ability to sleep in, your grand holidays.

Because anyone that tells you that you 'must' have kids is jealous of all those things.